New To Keto But Want To Grow Your Knowledge?
More specifically, you want help with Dr. Berg Interview Dave Feldman on the Truth About LDL Cholesterol?
[Music] hey guys I have a special guest today Dave Fellman he’s a senior software engineer okay so work he is the master at cholesterol you know and what we you know as far as a ketogenic diet goes there’s so many people that have questions about all different aspects but one we’re gonna focus on today has to do with what happens when your cholesterol goes up because Dave is the man to go to I mean I think it really takes someone from the outside of the now profession that has enough space enough data on logic and systems and looking at computers to really observe this is these interesting phenomena so because I think your body is very similar to a computer it has certain systems and feedback loops and so so I guess the the let’s just talk about the the most important thing I want to bring up can we discuss what happens when you dookied oh you’re doing in a minute fasting and all of a sudden your cluster goes up and then you start freaking out is that a concern and let’s talk about that well of course I per your original comment I like to joke that the human body was doing cloud computing long before we were and indeed just like a computer it can be a bit complex so I try not to answer you know should I be concerned or shouldn’t I be by a single marker but I will say this I will say that to this very day I’m finding more and more that LDL is one of the least useful markers to look at to determine your metabolic health and that actually there’s a very mechanistically sensible reason for your LDL to climb when you grow on a low card ketogenic diet if you’re being fueled by fat a lot more and so I’m gonna try not to get into the weeds too much I sort of want to keep this you know friendly for for any audience member but one of the most common misconceptions that does need to get relieved is that many people think when you’re on a ketogenic diet that all of the fat you eat gets burned into or gets gets broken down into ketones and it’s not actually true a fraction of the fatty acids you ingest will get turned into get ketones and that’s especially important for the brain but actually the majority of energy your tissues are using are in the form of fatty acids that you’re ingesting and that are also stored in your fat cells in your body that are provided directly to your cells and one of the means by which they’re provided or in these kinds of boats that I know you talked about in some of your videos before that we like to call lipoproteins lipid carrying proteins these these boats are actually amazing it’s the genius of the human body that it makes it because it carries all of the different lipids these fats that include not just what you’re using for energy but also include cholesterol and cholesterol it’s a common misconception people think of cholesterol as being the same as poison almost and that our body is weirdly are making this poison to kill us but the truth is cholesterol is in every single cell in your body in fact the animal kingdom couldn’t function without cholesterol holding the membranes of every single one of those cells together yeah exactly and I think that’s a good point just to bring up from the very beginning um we need cholesterol to make hormones doesn’t would you agree that cholesterol one of the functions is it’s kind of like a protective type band-aid or protective absolutely yeah absolutely well and another common misconception is that the cholesterol in your blood is deleterious and that the lower your cholesterol the better right as I’m as I’m sure you’re aware there are many many studies that indicate that when people really bottomed out on cholesterol there’s a a wide range of different problems that can occur there’s lots of issues with cognition there are a lot of problems with sex hormones a lot of females for example will lose their cycle unfortunately there there are many other issues that can come up with for example infection and disease a lot of people don’t realize that these same boats were talking about also clear pathogens in the body and this is why people who even have the genetic disneys known as familial hypercholesterolemia which is genetically they have higher levels of lipoproteins are known to survive pandemics which is why it was considered an advantage before the 20th century because you typically had a longer survival time when infection was a much bigger concern not that it isn’t a big concern now but particularly as you get older I mean the data is very compelling that the higher your cholesterol the more likely your survival and it’s certainly something you want to be very mindful of before you consider taking medication wow that’s awesome being an engineer let’s compare this the feedback loop with what happens when you increase or decrease your dietary cluster on that that’s right I call it the inversion pattern so to be sure a lot of people go on a ketogenic diet and kind of unintuitive Li the more the more lean and/or fit you are surprisingly the more likely it is that your C or LDL cholesterol go up and that’s what I found in my case my sister and my dad had also got inspired to go on the huge ink guide at the same time I did their cholesterol went up just slightly mine went up by a lot and so that’s what got me very inspired to try to look into what was going on and sure enough I found that my baseline cholesterol while higher if I then added a lot of fat like I ate a lot more fat it would then go down likewise if I if I fasted or if I just brought down the total amount of fat I was eating it would then go back up again and this is super important to get out to your listeners because one of the common problems that occur with people who try to go on a low-carb diet and then try to score a good cholesterol test is that though often bring down the amount of saturated fat they have in the days before the test and there’s enormous amounts of data that both I have demonstrated and many of my followers that that’ll actually spike your total and LDL cholesterol and it typically makes your triglycerides go higher and your HDL go lower that’s the inversion pattern in inverts and so I demonstrated in my first public presentation of my data this inversion pattern by going the other way I ate a ton of fat I was in fact through this conference that I was holding the presentation for I had a cooler next to me where I was just constantly grabbing meats and cheeses and I was taking it down and in my presentation I said you’re actually watching my LDL cholesterol plummet and I’ve bet my entire reputation all my data on it that when I get a blood test tomorrow it’s gonna show that it’s dropped substantially in 3 days and that’s exactly what happened and so a lot of people said would you do a write up for this and kind of tell us how how we can do this and that’s what I did at my site cholesterol code comm it’s now commonly known as the Feldman protocol I’m Bette many of your your listeners have done this as well because it’s shared all over the place it’s unintuitive but you eat a lot of fat coming up to a cholesterol test and there’s about an 85 percent success rate for the likelihood that you’ll actually see your LDL go down you know this I mean it’s right in guidance physiology they found that the people that eat more cholesterol goes because there’s a there’s this balance mechanism the body will it make adjustments it just produces less it controls the excess so for those of you that miss that cholesterol co.com in fact I want to play this I have a closed Facebook lab and we do kind of some experiments here and there I want to actually see if I can have everyone do it we have a hundred thousand people so oh wow and everyone to do that will get some great data just to just you know I think you all see you you mentioned something about hyper responders and you want to kind of just touch on that I do so a hyper responder is actually a term that predates my time – the ketogenic diet and what it was was basically a way to refer to those people when they go on a ketogenic diet see a dramatic increase in their LDL the the common refrain is your LDL may go up a little and may go down a little but odds are you’re not one of these small subsets of people for which a lot of people worried I myself was one of them when I found out I was a hyper responder Lucy is a fifty hundred percent increase in their LDL so my LDL before I went on huge a diet was around 131 I think was the last test I’d had and it had jumped up to 270 which any doctor is gonna say two things one they’re gonna say stop doing what you’re doing and two I have some drugs I would like you to look at to help get that number back down and again I’m an engineer I will tell you there’s a very big difference in the culture between those and medicine and those in engineering and those of us in engineering I’m telling you you could you could have the biggest bigwig engineer senior engineer walk into a meeting with a whole bunch of juniors and if that engineer says something that’s ridiculous the junior engineers will challenge and because every engineer starts from the assumption that they’re skeptical of everybody and every piece of data they’d like to take it apart themselves and that’s what I did I started taking apart the lipid system well that’s that’s where I found what seems to be a big originating factor – hyper responders the reason for the higher amount of cholesterol that I was getting had a lot to do with my being leaner and thinner than my dad and my sister who were very closely related and I’ll tell you I literally done an experiment that I’m actually still kind of in the process of it’s pretty long one where I’ve intentionally gained body fat about 20 pounds of body fat and I incidentally don’t want anyone to follow me on this one but I have a huge wealth of biometric data leading up to this point so I wanted to actually capture what I believed to be would be the case where my LDL cholesterol would be actually if my body fat were higher and I’m happy to tell you right now that that’s exactly what it was at the very last day of my weight gain experiment I was back down to 130 LDL but having having what would be considered a typical standard American diet because I had to leave Quito in order to gain weight and it worked and I was having footlong Subway sandwiches I was having pizza and I wasn’t even having that much sugar it was mainly just starches but it worked to not only get give me a lot of weight but on top of that it dropped my LDL down to 130 milligrams per deciliter I know my prior position had I shown them my numbers from Quito and shown that my numbers from the standard American diet they probably go you’re doing great that’s that’s so much better but but it gives me a segue to talk about the two metrics and that same lipid panel that matters so much more and that is your triglycerides and your HDL cholesterol and and I’m telling you right now that I have a challenge that’s not on Twitter that they haven’t been able to answer yet which is I’ve been able to find studies that show if you stratify populations for having low triglycerides and high HDL cholesterol is something we see with people going on a ketogenic diet their total cardiovascular disease risk and they’re all cause mortality improved substantially so it’s only when they remove those stratifications that you get a weak correlation with LDL cholesterol and again this is this is a challenge I’ve been putting out for quite a long time now and that’s why for me I mean I can only speak for myself but for me I would much rather have an LDL of 270 so on his mind triglycerides are super low and my HDL is super high I see that Wow so let’s just touch on this one point about let’s say for example your triglycerides are low and your ADL hgo is high yet you have high LDL in someone’s mind initially they’re gonna go oh my gosh that’s the bad cholesterol it’s going through my blood what is it doing do they need to do special like at Essen and mr test to figure out what like the type of cholesterol you want to touch on that high and I and I will say this the NMR you’re talking about it’s a nuclear magnetic resonance test and at the time that I was coming into Kido I myself was very adamant about getting that because it it does more than just capture those four metrics total LDL cholesterol HDL cholesterol and triglycerides it also grabs the boats themselves we were just talking about the lipoproteins and it breaks them out into their different types so you hear about the small dense versus the big fluffy and the small dense is apparently more a thorough genic as they would call which means it’s more likely to be associated with the build-up of plaque and the arteries and the big fluffy are supposed to be generally benign so they don’t they don’t have that same risk because they’re very buoyant they don’t crash into your your arteries as I heard the refrain go but the truth is when it comes down to it I’ve yet to see any compelling data that LDL particles that aren’t modified in some fashion that aren’t oxidized or glycated are in fact a threat at all and I realize that this is this is a something that kind of goes against what is considered to be conventional medical wisdom the bottom line is is the pathogenesis the the actual disease state has never been demonstrated with a thorough Scott o’clock in the absence of injury to the vessel walls or oxidative stress or basically anything that shows a breakdown of the system itself so this is this is why like having low triglycerides is such a good sign because if you have a lot of boats but a little bit of cargo it means the boats are succeeding at dropping that cargo off so you don’t even need to be a big senior engineer to realize this if you’re watching boats that are going out of the harbor and they’re coming back in the– sounds like it’s proper shipping all around so let’s just help people to when you talk about boats you’re talking about the carrier of cholesterol LDL and HDL so basically when someone talks about HDL LDL they’re talking about a protein that is caring not just cholesterol triglycerides fat soluble vitamins and antioxidants yeah yeah so basically these boats are carrying material for for healing repair building tissue cellular functions and things like that right basically everything your cells need that is not already water soluble so if you can’t swim on its own in the bloodstream again genius of the human body the body says no worries I’ve got one kind of boat I’m gonna pack it all in two and the primary cargo dr. Berg the primary cargo is fat based energy this triglycerides and that’s why triglycerides being low in the blood is a good sign we’re actually on a ketogenic diet we’re actually powered by triglycerides and that gets confusing because a lot of people say well wait a sec I think triglycerides go down well triglycerides left and the bloodstream go down because the usage is higher but having low triglycerides in the blood whether you’re on a fat based diet or not aren’t tightly associated with positive outcomes so basically when we’re talking about LDL and H and HDL we’re talking about it’s not just the cholesterol it’s the triglycerides they’re caring and that this red is used for energy and other things yeah absolutely it’s it’s primarily energy but it can be used for other building materials so okay so then let’s just touch on another point that you mentioned which is the the reason why it’s going in in the first place well part of this picture it’s it’s trying to fix some damage some oxidative damage a lesion in the inside of the artery wall right let’s let’s touch on that and maybe what could cause that absolutely and you – forgive me I’m gonna geek out a little bit here okay so the best way to think of it is when you get a cholesterol test and you’re capturing these LDL particles the truth is the vast vast majority of them started as something known as the LDLs very low-density lipoproteins and these vldls are the ones that are bloated with the triglycerides they have tons and tons of this fat based energy those things actually drop off the energy very very quickly and so it’s in just a matter of less than an hour of the LDL is becomes what’s known as an ideal which is an intermediate density lipoprotein and then in less than half an hour it turns into an LDL so when you see your when you see your bloodstream as blood markers you actually should have a small number of those vldls and thus a small number of triglycerides if everything is working properly so that LDL stage that’s not an hour half hour that’s 2 to 4 days now you might wonder what why would the body want LDL particles these boats if they no longer have any triglycerides the energy to deliver why would the body want them in the bloodstream and the truth is for many different reasons they actually serve many roles so I discussed earlier how they bind a pathogen so they have an immunological role just just the same as your monocytes for example they’re they’re part of that but they’re also part of the reparative process so imagine for example a whole bunch of people whose job it is is to get into delivery truck and in one hour they deliver a bunch of food but then they have kind of an all-purpose job where they’re traveling the neighborhood they’re looking for bad guys to run off the road or they’re looking for a house that’s damaged where you know they happen to have some lumber in the back that they can then pull up and try to help and fix it right cells actually have receptors yet that’s they’re like little they’re like little arms they actually reach out to grab these when they’re in need of the things that are on board and then they can endocytosis if they actually it’s calling it’s like golfing it golfing and entirely and then they have everything that’s inside it for their own use cholesterol is one of the things that’s part of its cargo but the lipoprotein itself is also made of something known as phospholipids well guess what our cell membranes are made of they’re made of free cholesterol and phospholipids so cells when they can’t synthesize enough on their own fortunately the body wisely make sure a lot of those lipoproteins are just ready and able to be provided for the cells to be able to get use of and that’s why it doesn’t surprise me by the way when many people go on statins will report having muscle pain particularly they tend to be a bit more athletic this for me I mean I and again I’m not really put a lot of research into this but I would not be surprised at all if it’s the lack of availability for LDL particles for muscle repair and growth which is absolutely what they get used for so that whole stage I mean the whole stage of low-density lipoproteins I know it gets villainized a lot but it’s actually very powerful and necessary to the body where we find problems with LDL particles being associated with cardiovascular disease and risk is where we find that they may in fact be getting recruited at a higher amount so here’s what I’m going to get a little geeky if you don’t mind describe those cells that line our vessel wall they’re called endothelial cells and endothelial cells when they get damaged they release a signaling molecule that signaling molecule is known as a cytokine and those cytokines at a certain amount when there’s really a problem that actually signals the liver to route to up regulate more low-density lipoproteins so it’s actually calling for help very specifically for low-density lipoproteins because it’s so important for muscle repair when you when you twist your ankle and you see some of the swelling and some of the heat and so forth there’s dozens of different chemical reactions that are going on right but part of what there trying to do the swelling itself is they’re trying to pool blood they’re trying to get those raw materials to that area and something a lot of people don’t realize is there’s something known as growth hormone particularly platelet-derived growth hormone that endothelial cells when they’re in the presence of will express more LDL receptors now I am an engineer dr. Byrd I’m an engineer and when I see processes already in place that not only say hey this could possibly have something to do with lipoproteins but are specifically receptors that bind to little poor low-density lipoproteins themselves I have to say give me a reason why this is inappropriate for the body to be making available to the cells right Wow that is it’s just it must from just the level of understanding that you have it must be almost I don’t know how you react to it but you have this other group of people out there that are saying no no no it’s the cholesterol and fat is that’s the main problem which is totally the exact opposite and I don’t know how you react to it but the the one thing I want to mention is like through you know some people are saying that no it’s the it’s the fat it’s the cholesterol that is causing the insulin resistance I guess it’s fat within the muscle receptor for instance I don’t know I don’t know exactly the argument but it’s what’s your what’s your thought on that well in your you’re talking to somebody who probably has more personal data points than maybe anybody you’ll ever even meet I I am close to about a hundred blood draws since November 2015 and it’s completely ridiculous I’m commonly referred to as a human pincushion but I’m a bit OCD and making sure I conduct these experiments in a very controlled manner and I the vast majority of these tests I have fasting insulin so I’m very very mindful of exactly what my basal insulin loads are and from that perspective I I have to point this out I have observed these changes and how much they correlate with weight gain weight loss how much they correlate with fasting glucose and so forth and without question the points in which I am at the highest levels of saturated fat in my diet the lowest levels of carbs and at very moderate levels of protein I have absolutely floored near bottom insulin levels typically under a 2 to 4 milli I am just really really super low but on top of that there’s a particular group of people that you may have heard me talk about that are kind of step beyond hyper responders I call them lean massive responders they tend to have the highest levels of LDL but they also tend to have the lowest levels the triglycerides and the highest levels of HDL so they’re almost like a super class they operate on really really really low levels of insulin I I call them in it basically in a blended fasted state and I guarantee I know several that eat 5000 calories a day mostly fat and it is absolutely having nearly no impact on their insulin levels because you need insulin primarily particularly the postcranial insulin to deal with glucose glucose coming into the blood your body actually slowly adjusts to exactly how much insulin it needs to use to shuttle energy away and it seeks to keep that as low as possible it does this because the higher your insulin the less capability your body has for something known as a tapa G and that’s that’s kind of like the housekeeping that your cells get to to make use of so this is why by the way I think people on the far end I speculates totally speculative but I believe these people these lean mass hype responders may be enjoying a higher level of etapa G and might literally be actually having their cells aged a little slower because of that being in a blended fastest state is very powerful and that’s why the ketogenic diet is so powerful is you’re in many is mimicking a fasted state which there are plenty of studies on long before the ketogenic diet became big as to why that’s so good for longevity Wow so Wow this this is fascinating what’s your thought on some of the top few triggers two things that can start this whole cascade of affect like I know insulin is gonna be pretty one at the top the list right yeah you talk in the Cascade of affect that can bring around a disease state like with cardiovascular disease yes endothelial cells yes so here’s where it’s gonna get a little there’s there’s kind of almost two channels two directions we can go and ironically or maybe not so ironically they both kind of end up with higher levels of triglycerides this is why I’m very mindful to watch for triglycerides so the first one is you actually reach what is known as the personal fat threshold and that tends to be somewhat individualistic there can be some commonalities with ethnicities but what that means is you’re probably insulin sensitive up to a point where you’ve now part so much triglycerides into your adipose tissue again your body fat that now your body needs to find other places to park those triglycerides so this is where you come up with things like fatty liver fatty pancreas even places you really don’t want to see fat like say parts and heart muscle and so forth right that’s that’s a huge sign and a very common one for insulin resistance and this is this is where you also tend to see a lot of this you see a lot of things like just a larger waist circumference and so forth that you want to be mindful of well this is getting back to sort of the fasted in fed state this is where you’re now moving your body into a place in which it’s more predominantly in what it believes is a fed state and how you can know this is because fasting insulin is high if you’re if you have fast if you’ve fasted for 12 hours and your fasting insulin is above 10 for example then what’s going on is your body still feels like there’s too much energy and that usually is the case you find your fasting glucose is pretty high and it’s still keeping the insulin high to try to put it away well now you have less etapa Chi you have less of your cells abilities to do their housekeeping because it’s like the lunch Bell is constantly ringing right well this is a big problem for cardiovascular health too because now even the endothelial cells don’t get their housekeeping time and they need that state switch because a lot of people don’t know this high density lipoproteins the HDL the so-called good cholesterol they need a fasted phase they need a low level of insulin to get their job done so during the period of time where insulin is high like when people get really sick for example and there you’ve heard the term feed feed a cold right there’s there is a tiny bit of truth to that and that that as insulin goes up it’s part of not just the store and build state but it’s also oftentimes part of the fight state it’s often a way by which your body can fight disease and my colleague Siobhan Huggins by the way gets into this quite a bit this is how insulin resistance can sometimes proceed hyperinsulinemia high levels of insulin in the blood well again this is important because if you’re not getting the switch back and forth between being fasted and being fed and being fasted or for that matter fighting a disease and then getting back to fasted your your emergency vehicles these HDL particles they don’t have the time to also go out and grab the excess cholesterol that might have been used as part of the reparative process and what is also known very commonly in the literature is reverse cholesterol transport they’re not able to get as much of that time as they need to get it done overall you just want to have a larger amount of time in a fasted State this isn’t even by practice and fasting but just by remaining insulin resistant so not maxing out your personal threshold in the first place sorry I know there was a bit of a long-winded answer but to really kind of unpack it it’s important to kind of get that sense there I mean as an engineer it makes perfect sense you have insulin handling a lot of things at the same time so why not go ahead and piggyback these other operations on it if throughout all of our ancestral history we knew they were infrequent right we knew when we eat it wasn’t going to be very common or if we were eating a small amount that it wouldn’t take a lot of insulin to deal with the food that was necessary and therefore we could count on many other operations you know piggybacking on to insulin so in short whether you’re on a high-fat diet or a low-fat diet or whatever diet you’re on if it brings about persistently high insulin in the blood it’s almost necessarily the worst kind of state you can be it Wow so let’s go back because there’s one point that I want to clarify you mentioned something about reverse something reverse reverse cholesterol transport yes let’s just define that so people drink sure so LDL particles these ones that we’re talking about they’re often talked about as bad because they’ll put cholesterol into the arterial walls it’s really a huge oversimplification but there is some truth to that and part of the reparative process can be argued is in fact atherosclerosis it’s just progressive atherosclerosis is clearly bad just like progressively just like insulin is not bad you need insulin but progressively high levels of insulin aren’t bad inflammation absolutely can’t live without inflammation chronic inflammation is bad right so we fully anticipate the operating system the human operating system fully anticipates that cholesterol is coming in to cells on a constant basis and for many reasons both for the reparative and also for the cells themselves but likewise there’s this whole fleet of HDL particles these high density lipoproteins that are on hand that are constantly also part of the pulling it back out and that’s why they’re commonly associated with having better outcomes for cardiovascular disease the higher your HDL see almost universally the better your outcome with cardiovascular disease they it’s reverse cholesterol transport they reverse they bring it out of the tissues and then they take it back to the liver and some of that cholesterol is reusable and they will use it your body is actually greedy about holding on to and using cholesterol it’s very hard for it to make and there’s some that’s not so good and that that isn’t so good goes out through bile acids that we make and goes into our digestive system and that eventually gets sent back to the other side if you know what I mean so basically it’s kind of a a reverse is that a buffer or is it a reverse everything just works in Reverse I I don’t know if I’d say everything works in Reverse but it’s basically a means by which cholesterol has taken out of tissues and brought to the liver kind of recycling yeah recycling is actually a really good way of putting it okay in yeah so that the oxy sterols the the oxidized cholesterol and so forth that ends up getting sent out but anything that’s usable cholesterol that’s going to end up getting reused so so as a reparative action you have cholesterol you also have a calcium right calcium tell yes calcification that tends to be on a more advanced level though that usually tends to that’s kind of to keep it layperson friendly that’s where things are bad to the point that we just want to pave over the area Kathleen but yes that would be a good way of putting it so the coronary artery calcium scoring test that’s a pretty isn’t about it’s a valuable test right to get great yes yes and to be sure there is a little bit of risk that should always be mentioned and that there is some exposure to radiation I think the last one I saw was like 0.6 millisievert something like that comparable to a mammogram I believe a mammogram 0.4 so that would be nothing compared to like a cat scan of your abdomen or your kidneys right no no no in fact a cat scan tends to be the equivalent of around 200 chest x-rays yeah so we by the way I just want to insert real quick I know it’s common practice for a hospital to just give you a CT for any particular reason be very mindful of that that really is a lot of radiation exposure and just you know I would want to say it feel confident that what they’re awarding it is appropriate given the ailments you’re talking about oh yeah they do and I do think it’s a modern problem but I’m glad you brought it up because I do believe that a CAC I mean as metrics go it is one of the most powerful neuro but there are if not be most powerful for disease progression detection certainly you can have heart disease without having calcification and that should definitely be said but if you do have council vacation you do want to know about it as soon as reasonably possible and you do want to understand its progression so it’s not even if you get a calcium score right now and like what would be considered a not good one would be say like a four hundred right if you find out that you have a four hundred it’s not really the end of the world what you want to be sure of is that it’s not progressing at a high rate such as like 50% per year or something along those lines you want to be sure that it’s you know if it’s progressing one or two percent let me put it this way I wouldn’t mind have or I would rather have a calcium score of 400 that was progressing at 1% per year then a calcium score of 50 that was progressing at 50 percent breeder right that’s like a no-brainer for me right but that’s but that’s important and I will say this one of the most heartbreaking thing is heartbreaking things that we have at cholesterol code calm is people that come that have just gotten their first CAC and they’re now four years into huge Inc diet they’ve had high LDL but they’ve they’re now questioning whether the high LDL was good because their first days four years in says that they have like say a 200 and the problem is is that there’s now no way to know how much of that was due to the lifestyle that they had before going ketogenic and how much was after and that’s why I generally give advice to people who are pretty sure they’re gonna go on keto forever that it’s it’s nice to get the CAC as close to when you started as possible so that you can actually have bookended you know when that data start it and that way you can I mean first of all certainly you would want to know if you had a CAC of like 200 or 300 or something at the point that you were starting to hear genic die anyway right um yeah okay I mean the you can’t evaluate something with one number you need two numbers before and after you need to see progression was it better worse and so do you I’m guessing you do in a minute fasting not exactly I would say probably my window so when I’m in the process of doing these experiments my intermittent fasting window may be something like 14 hours which I kind of don’t count because intermittent fasting I sort of feel like you have to be at least 16 hours to you know it’s it’s like at the ride where you have to be at least this tall I’m not I’m not quite that tall but but Gian do you do snack between meals I probably snack more than the typical ketover and I and this is actually fairly common for lean mass hyper responders you’ll find a lot of people who are very lean and or athletic who practice keto and actually they have a few things that are in common beyond being lean and or athletic and having very high levels of LDL they have a very difficult time doing fasting particularly law particularly very elongated fasting like multi day fasting they also tend to have higher fasting glucose levels which I believe is due to more adaptive glucose pairing but it’s important to keep the context in mind if if you have higher fasting glucose as you’ve gotten leaner and healthier and feel great don’t freak out because it’s very likely that you also have lower fasting insulin which is very suggested that it’s adaptive glucose very and by the way lean mass type responders also also tend to have lower levels of beta hydroxy butyrate so relative to a typical kid or for example they’ll tend to have like say you know point 4 to 1.0 and then they’ll be frustrated because they’re couch potato keto friend you know is running it like three or four or something along those lines but again all of this suggests higher faster utilization the reason I gave a little bit of that set up is that I probably like meeting my lean mass type responder friends and probably just having a tougher time fasting because my body is already in such a blended fasted state when I’m down at those levels that I get more signaling to do something about it so it’s it’s okay in fact that there’s already probably much more of the benefits of the fasted State in the first place the downside is that you know the famine hits Lima Cyprus martyrs will be the first to go like there’s a price for getting that way in it I think you’re not going to worry about the famine so that’s good anytime Lina yeah right exactly this is awesome do you have any um any less last points you want to bring up absolutely yeah so I have to tell you dr. bird one of the very first and biggest things that I want to get across to your listeners is please have a fasted cholesterol test or for that matter any blood tests you should be 12 to 14 hours water fasting if you were not and I know the current guidelines will say you don’t really need to be fasted but you physically are putting triglycerides from your food into your bloodstream and that is why oftentimes we have a lot of people that come to our site let’s say ever since I went keto it looks like my triglycerides have exploded and look at you know score of 200 or 300 and so the first question out of it shoot as we go was it a water only fasted what tests often times let’s say no they then retest later and it’s fine like everything’s you know below 100 or something along those lines so that’s number one number two is whatever your cholesterol score is if you see just 1% of my research you’ll find that it’s insanely dynamic it’s it’s I’ve moved my I move my numbers up and down hundreds of milligrams per deciliter in just three years I I had the unique distinction of having changed my lipid numbers more than anybody else in the world and I believe anybody else could actually do the same thing bear in mind this is about any medication supplements exercise anything and it’s it’s because the human body is actually fantastically a depth and very adaptable and cholesterol is really just kind of a shadow of the larger energy metabolism so you you really need to know that the lipid system is very dynamic and whatever your cholesterol score is you’d be surprised at how quickly it can change assuming that you’re close to metabolic flexibility I do want to throw in the caveat because if you’re kind of down the line it may take a little more while to recover from where you need to be but that brings me back to the last point I really want to get across which is even for somebody like myself who may be snacking more than the typical person or eating a little bit more in the typical person when I get down to my leaner levels you do want to have your body generally in a in a fasted state most of the time like this shouldn’t even really be shouldn’t really even need to say this but that’s what’s great about the ketogenic diet if you get it to work properly is you should actually be operating on very low levels of insulin overall and I believe that if you do it’s it’s such a huge benefit to longevity so that’s that’s definitely what I want to fit in awesome that was great advice Thanks thank you so much for this interview you guys you need to go to his website it’s cholesterol co.com cholesterol code calm alright thanks so much Dave I really appreciate it thanks for having me on dr. Berg I really love your material oh thanks
This Post Was All About Dr. Berg Interview Dave Feldman on the Truth About LDL Cholesterol.
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Dr. Berg: Hey guys I have a special guest today, Dave Feldman. He is a senior software engineer. He is the master at cholesterol. As far as the ketogenic diet goes, there’s so many people that have questions aout all different aspects. But one we are gonna focus on today has to do with what happens when your cholesterol goes up because Dave is the man to go to. I mean I think it really takes someone from the outside from that profession that has enough space, enough data on logic and systems and looking at the computers to really observe this interesting phenomena. Because I think our body is very similar to the computer. It has circuits, and systems, feedback and loops. I guess, let’s just talk about the most important thing I want to bring up. Can we discuss what happens when you do ketogenic diet, doing intermittent fasting and all of the sudden your cholesterol goes up and you start freaking out. Is that a concern? Let’s talk about that.
Dave: Well, of course for the pre-original comment I like to joke that the human body is doing a cloud computing long before we were. And indeed, just like a computer it can be a bit complex so I try not to answer should I be concern or shouldn’t I be by a single marker. But I will say this, I will say that to this very day, I am finding more and more that LDL is one of the least useful markers to look at to determine your metabolic health. And actually there is a very mechanistically sensible reason for your LDL to climb when you are going to a low carb ketogenic diet if you are being fueled by fat a lot more. And so I am gonna try not to get into the weeds too much, I sort of want to keep this you know friendly for any audience member. But one of the most common misconceptions that does need to get relieved is that, many people believe that when you are in the ketogenic diet that all of the fat you eat gets burned into.. or gets broken down into ketones and it’s not actually true. A fraction of fatty acids you ingest will turn into ketones and that is especially important for the brain. But actually the majority of energy that your tissues are using are in the form of fatty acids that you are ingesting and that are also stored in your fat cells in the body that are provided directly to your cells and what of the means by which they are provided are in this kinds of boats that I know you talked about in some of your videos before that we like to call lipoprotein, it is lipids carrying proteins. These boats are actually amazing. It’s the genius of the human body that it makes it because it carries all of the different lipids, these fats that includes not just for using of energy but also include cholesterol and cholesterol is a common misconception, people think of cholesterol as being the same as poison almost and that our body is weirdly are making this poison to kill us. But the truth is cholesterol is in every single cell in your body. In fact, the animal kingdom could not function without cholesterol holding the membranes of every single one of those cells together.
Dr. Eric Berg DC Bio:
Dr. Berg, 52 years of age is a chiropractor who specializes in Healthy Ketosis & Intermittent Fasting. His clients include senior officials in the U.S. government and the Justice Department, ambassadors, medical doctors, high-level executives of prominent corporations, scientists, engineers, professors, and other clients from all walks of life. He is the author of The New Body Type Guide and other books published by KB Publishing. Dr. Berg trains chiropractors, physicians and allied healthcare practitioners in his methods, and to date he has trained over 2,500 healthcare professionals. He has taught students nutrition as an adjunct professor at Howard University.
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